Showing posts with label Death. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Death. Show all posts

Sunday, August 2, 2020

Original Sin

This is a question I received with my response.

QUESTION-

I would like to know what your position is on the doctrine of original sin and how we are guilty of Adam's sin. I think that Adam's fallen and sinful nature has been transmitted to us, just as a virus that manifests itself and inevitably takes over like a zombie virus or vampirism. So it would be impossible to fight against it, unless some force outside of us frees us from this curse. I do not see that we are guilty of sin until the moment we sin, but we are bound to sin as having the virus of sin, at some point it will manifest. So I don't see that we are guilty of birth, but heirs of a nature with the incubated virus. but that does not make us sinners until the moment we actually commit sin, only at that moment are we guilty and responsible for what we practice. I see that unless someone dies as a newborn, they will sin. I would like to know your thoughts on this.

RESPONSE-

Your question is a good one! The doctrine of Original Sin is an important doctrine in the history of the Christian faith. However, there is substantial variety in the understanding of the doctrine by the major Christian denominations, and in fact, the doctrine is not even universally held. The underlying assumption that seems to be present in your question and analogy of virus transmission, is the understanding of imputed sin nature. As you state in your question, "I think that Adam's fallen and sinful nature has been transmitted to us, just as a virus that manifests itself and inevitably takes over like a zombie virus or vampirism."  This understanding is akin (although not identical) to the view historically held by many in Western Christianity whereby we inherit the sin nature from Adam's commission of the first sin in the Garden as well as Adam's guilt for his sin. In this view, most prominently proposed by Augustine, humanity cannot not sin, it is inevitable. This is similar to your view I think, although you disavow the personal guilt aspect. Additionally, Augustine would have been favorable toward your virus analogy as he felt that original sin was passed along biologically. However, in Eastern Christianity, a "softer" view prevails whereas the doctrine is seen more along the lines of our environment that has been tainted. Adam and Eve sinned, thereby tainting our environment, and to some degree our nature in that now we experience death, creating a context that we inherit in which we are now more likely to commit personal sin. In Eastern Orthodoxy, one would say that we all inherit the consequences of Adam's sin, but not the personal guilt. 

It is important to note that this doctrine is not typically considered a core or essential doctrine, meaning it is not required to believe in the doctrine or a particular version of the doctrine, to be considered a Christian. This is an in-house debate that is important, but not essential to the core gospel. What is core to the gospel is that "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God" (Rom 3:23) and "... there is no one righteous, not even one" (Rom 3:10). But the idea of the human race inheriting the original sin and guilt of Adam in some fashion is not an essential.

Dr. William Lane Craig has written and spoken fairly extensively on this topic. I particularly commend his "Defender Series"/Doctrine of Man on the topic to you and one of his answers to a previous "Question of the Week" - links to both are below. May God bless you richly Luis and thank you for reaching out!


http://www.reasonablefaith.org/defenders-2-podcast/s10
https://www.reasonablefaith.org/writings/question-answer/original-sin/

God and Morality - The Divine Command Theory

This is a question I received and my response.

QUESTION-

"As I understand it, you are a defender of the Divine Command Theory, that is, the idea that morality comes from what God commands. I heard an argument against said theory that I can't seem to get around. I would like to know your thoughts. The argument stems from the fact that there are verse in the Bible where god commands evil things. For example, in Deuteronomy chapter 13 verses 13-16 he says "that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. You are to gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. That town is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt" In that verse, God commands the slaughter and total destruction of a town because they do not believe in God, and he says to do this "as a... offering to the Lord" This verse as well as other verses would certainly offend our moral sensibilities. The argument, then, is that because of this verse and others like it you can not get morality from the Bible. Let me explain. When confronted with this kind of verse, one has two options. One is that that kind of verse is not an expression of God's will, and one that it is. If we go with the former option, that it isn't an expression of God's will, then it's impossible to extract any value from the Bible as a moral document because we are simply choosing which verses are God's will and which aren't subjectively, and if we can do that the Bible stops being morally useful. What is stopping someone from using only the Bible verse we think of as evil and constructing a moral theory around that. If we still want to hold on to the idea that morality comes from the Bible, one must say that the verse I cited and others like it are an expression of God's will. That leaves us with two more options, either that the verse I cited and others like it are moral, and that they are not moral. If we choose the former option, then we are degrading the entire concept of morality into simply what God commands. God could command anything and it would still be moral under this view, thus making the entire concept meaningless. If we choose the latter option, than what good is a moral theory if it produce immoral outcomes? Why would any chose to get their morality from said source? I'd like to hear your thoughts on the argument. It seems inescapable to me, but I don't know if I'm missing something. Thanks! Sincerely, -Matt"

RESPONSE-

Matthew, this is a good question and one which Dr. William Lane Craig deals with extensively. I will include a couple of reference links at the end of my answer for your further consideration. To begin let's review the Divine Command theory basis for morality to make sure we are on a level set regarding the claim. On Divine Command theory, moral values are derived from the *nature* of God who, as the greatest conceivable being, is the sum, definition, and ground of all moral values. By this, we mean that our values regarding good and evil, right and wrong, are derived from and grounded in, God's very nature. Moral duties refer to our obligations to act and behave in ways consistent with our moral values. These duties are derived from the commands of God, that in turn are grounded in and flow from his nature. So, in summary, our moral values are grounded in God's nature and our moral duties are derived from God's commands, and God's commands are grounded in and flow from his nature.

From that understanding of Divine Command theory, we can draw one important conclusion that is relevant to your question. Namely, that God cannot command something inconsistent with his nature, otherwise he would cease to be the greatest conceivable being and the supreme good thus undermining his own essential nature. Therefore, God's commands are consistent with his nature. So if we properly understand his commands we can be assured that those commands are consistent with his nature as the supreme good and ground of our moral values. But, clearly, this does not mean that your or my, or any other particular person's sense of what is moral, will agree with God's definition! When we consider a command that God gives, such as the command found in Deuteronomy you referenced in your question, we should rightly ask, "Is this a true and accurate representation of God's command?" If it is a true representation of God's command, then it is morally right whether you agree with it or not! That is the essence of the Divine Command theory. God is the definition of morality and from his character/nature, he commands. We are imperfect, limited, conflicted, and impure in our natures and understanding thus a very flawed moral agent. But as you noted this leaves us with some interesting, perhaps troubling, options in the face of such commands that offend our moral sensibilities. But my point here is to remember our moral sensibilities are flawed and corrupt! They exist, as reflections of our Creator and definition of moral values and duties to be sure, but our sensibilities are by definition *ours* and therefore limited and flawed.

Remembering the above, let's tackle the potentially troubling options you mention. It is certainly possible that the Bible is not presenting a true and accurate representation of God's command. But, as you note that would certainly open up some difficulties hermeneutically. But those difficulties can be addressed by proper hermeneutic principles and techniques to include textual criticism, for example, that might enable us to determine the passage in question had been corrupted over time. Manuscript evidence might show an alternate reading that resolves or relieves some of the issues. These types of tools are required to get an accurate reading and understanding of the text throughout scripture so this is not any form of "special pleading" it is simply the appropriate way to handle any ancient text in order to derive an accurate reading and understanding of the text. But, this is not our only option regarding the reading of the text. The text may be giving a perfectly true and accurate recounting of God's command but simply not providing all of the background details that would put the command in an adequate context for a modern reader to properly understand. This I believe to be the case in the passage you mentioned and the other similar passages to which you allude. This explanation assumes that there are adequate reasons and context details that would make a command to kill people morally acceptable. Dr. Craig deals with this in his explanation regarding the "slaughter of the Canaanites" to which I include a reference at the end of my answer. For example, would we consider it morally just to kill another human being to defend ourselves or a loved one? Would we consider it morally right, to kill in the case where an enraged man was beating a baby and the only way to save the baby was to kill the man? Was killing justifiable to stop the Nazis? It is clear that, given sufficient justifying details of context, the act of killing other humans can be morally justifiable. Therefore, the command from God to kill could certainly be justifiable. Consider further that God is omniscient. As much as you or I might know about a situation, God knows *all* about a situation! He not only knows all current facts but also knows the hearts of each individual completely. He also knows what free choices each person would make given any future situation (middle knowledge) and what future situations those people will encounter, and he knows all this perfectly. So, if God is the very definition of goodness, mercy, justice, love, etc then when he commands he is commanding in perfect consistency with those attributes of his nature, and he is commanding with the perfect knowledge of the entire context. While we cannot possibly have the full context in a few verses of scripture, God has absolutely perfect knowledge of the context and of all hearts and minds involved.

In light of the above, we do not have to choose between, God is giving immoral commands, or scripture is flawed in its representation of God's commands. Rather, scripture is providing an accurate, but necessarily limited, description of the context in which the Divine command is given. Were we to know and understand *all* factors that God knows, we would find sufficient justification for the command to be morally acceptable. Now, to refer back to a previous point, that does not mean you will agree! As we both know, there are people who would say there is never any justification to kill another human being. They believe capital punishment is immoral. They believe self-defense is immoral. But that is their subjective moral position that is clearly not in alignment with God's revealed nature and commands. His justice and even mercy dictate that in certain cases it is justifiable to kill. Individual human beings can have their moral sensibilities troubled by the perfect moral nature of God!

Hopefully, this helps Matthew. Please see the two below references for what Dr. Craig has to say about these issues. God bless you!

https://www.reasonablefaith.org/writings/question-answer/slaughter-of-the-canaanites

Thursday, October 29, 2009

Hell, A Very Serious Subject

Don't be scared by the title or the length of this article. Jesus spoke often about hell so we must think about it and absorb its horendous truth.

"How Willingly Do People Go to Hell?
Does Anyone Standing by the Lake of Fire Jump In?
October 29, 2009By John Piper
Read this article on our website.
C.S. Lewis is one of the top 5 dead people who have shaped the way I see and respond to the world. But he is not a reliable guide on a number of important theological matters. Hell is one of them. His stress is relentlessly that people are not “sent” to hell but become their own hell. His emphasis is that we should think of “a bad man’s perdition not as a sentence imposed on him but as the mere fact of being what he is.” (For all the relevant quotes, see Martindale and Root, The Quotable Lewis, 288-295.)
This inclines him to say, “All that are in hell choose it.” And this leads some who follow Lewis in this emphasis to say things like, “All God does in the end with people is give them what they most want.”
I come from the words of Jesus to this way of talking and find myself in a different world of discourse and sentiment. I think it is misleading to say that hell is giving people what they most want. I’m not saying you can’t find a meaning for that statement that’s true, perhaps in Romans 1:24-28. I’m saying that it’s not a meaning that most people would give to it in light of what hell really is. I’m saying that the way Lewis deals with hell and the way Jesus deals with it are very different. And we would do well to follow Jesus.
The misery of hell will be so great that no one will want to be there. They will be weeping and gnashing their teeth (Matthew 8:12). Between their sobs, they will not speak the words, “I want this.” They will not be able to say amid the flames of the lake of fire (Revelation 20:14), “I want this.” “The smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night” (Revelation 14:11). No one wants this.
When there are only two choices, and you choose against one, it does not mean that you want the other, if you are ignorant of the outcome of both. Unbelieving people know neither God nor hell. This ignorance is not innocent. Apart from regenerating grace, all people “suppress the truth in unrighteousness” (Romans 1:18).
The person who rejects God does not know the real horrors of hell. This may be because he does not believe hell exists, or it may be because he convinces himself that it would be tolerably preferable to heaven.
But whatever he believes or does not believe, when he chooses against God, he is wrong about God and about hell. He is not, at that point, preferring the real hell over the real God. He is blind to both. He does not perceive the true glories of God, and he does not perceive the true horrors of hell.
So when a person chooses against God and, therefore, de facto chooses hell—or when he jokes about preferring hell with his friends over heaven with boring religious people—he does not know what he is doing. What he rejects is not the real heaven (nobody will be boring in heaven), and what he “wants” is not the real hell, but the tolerable hell of his imagination.
When he dies, he will be shocked beyond words. The miseries are so great he would do anything in his power to escape. That it is not in his power to repent does not mean he wants to be there. Esau wept bitterly that he could not repent (Hebrew 12:17). The hell he was entering into he found to be totally miserable, and he wanted out. The meaning of hell is the scream: “I hate this, and I want out.”
What sinners want is not hell but sin. That hell is the inevitable consequence of unforgiven sin does not make the consequence desirable. It is not what people want—certainly not what they “most want.” Wanting sin is no more equal to wanting hell than wanting chocolate is equal to wanting obesity. Or wanting cigarettes is equal to wanting cancer.
Beneath this misleading emphasis on hell being what people “most want” is the notion that God does not “send” people to hell. But this is simply unbiblical. God certainly does send people to hell. He does pass sentence, and he executes it. Indeed, worse than that. God does not just “send,” he “throws.” “If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown (Greek eblethe) into the lake of fire” (Revelation 20:15; cf. Mark 9:47; Matthew 13:42; 25:30).
The reason the Bible speaks of people being “thrown” into hell is that no one will willingly go there, once they see what it really is. No one standing on the shore of the lake of fire jumps in. They do not choose it, and they will not want it. They have chosen sin. They have wanted sin. They do not want the punishment. When they come to the shore of this fiery lake, they must be thrown in.
When someone says that no one is in hell who doesn’t want to be there, they give the false impression that hell is within the limits of what humans can tolerate. It inevitably gives the impression that hell is less horrible than Jesus says it is.
We should ask: How did Jesus expect his audience to think and feel about the way he spoke of hell? The words he chose were not chosen to soften the horror by being accommodating to cultural sensibilities. He spoke of a “fiery furnace” (Matthew 13:42), and “weeping and gnashing teeth” (Luke 13:28), and “outer darkness” (Matthew 25:30), and “their worm [that] does not die” (Mark 9:48), and “eternal punishment” (Matthew 25:46), and “unquenchable fire” (Mark 9:43), and being “cut in pieces” (Matthew 24:51).
These words are chosen to portray hell as an eternal, conscious experience that no one would or could ever “want” if they knew what they were choosing. Therefore, if someone is going to emphasize that people freely “choose” hell, or that no one is there who doesn’t “want” to be there, surely he should make every effort to clarify that, when they get there, they will not want this.
Surely the pattern of Jesus—who used blazing words to blast the hell-bent blindness out of everyone— should be followed. Surely, we will grope for words that show no one, no one, no one will want to be in hell when they experience what it really is. Surely everyone who desires to save people from hell will not mainly stress that it is “wantable” or “chooseable,” but that it is horrible beyond description—weeping, gnashing teeth, darkness, worm-eaten, fiery, furnace-like, dismembering, eternal, punishment, “an abhorrence to all flesh” (Isaiah 66:24).
I thank God, as a hell-deserving sinner, for Jesus Christ my Savior, who became a curse for me and suffered hellish pain that he might deliver me from the wrath to come. While there is time, he will do that for anyone who turns from sin and treasures him and his work above all.
Trembling before such realities, and trusting Jesus"

Pastor John Piper

Tuesday, July 21, 2009

Why Heaven?

When listening or reading certain treatments of the topic of heaven one could get the impression that heaven's joy is its streets of gold, pearly gates, beautiful angelic music, and reunion with friends and family. But this would be a subtle and tragic mistake. The Bible does paint an awe inspiring picture of heaven but leaves no doubt that the joy of Heaven is God Himself! The throne of God and the Lamb (Jesus) is the centerpiece and focal point of heaven (Rev 22:1-4). The point of heaven is that God will be there in the midst of His people, He is the gift, the reward, the treasure that we are to enjoy for eternity (Rev 21)! All the other benefits of heaven find their significance in that God Himself is in the midst of His people (Rev 22).

So this has tremendous implications for what it means to be a Christian and "heaven bound". The essential element to being a Christian is having been transformed from not loving and treasuring God to loving and treasuring God above all else! This is done through a sovereign work of God's grace to change our hearts from hard and rebellious to soft and submissive toward God (Ezekiel 11:19-20). Christians are ones who have been changed from hating His word and ways to loving His word and ways. Unless our hearts are in concert with the Apostle Paul's in longing for Christ's presence we have no reason to assume we will occupy the heaven in which Christ is the main attraction (2 Timothy 4:8).

Do you claim to be a Christian? Then test your claim by asking yourself this question, "why do I want to go to heaven"? If the answer isn't, "because Jesus is there!" you have reason to be very worried. Fall on your knees and cry out to God. Ask for a new heart of tender affection for Christ. Ask for a love for God and His kingdom, His ways and word. Ask Him to bring you to heaven...so that you can be with the lover of your soul, Jesus Christ!